Photo on page and help

i only joined your forum a while ago and its great to be seeing what you guys do.
Random pic on the home page guys,do i go sicckkk or be sick,both
Nah its cool,i think the anglers are awsome.
An opinion or two?
Just having a bit of a prob with ich and maybe oodinium,no one has died yet,they are scractching and showing a white film over at least one of the ocys eyes.
i quarantined them when i bought them,that was three weeks ago and they are just starting to not look so good.
All levels are great,got the nitrates down to near zero now.
Opinions please

As far as the Angler goes, i was talkin to Admin about it earlier and said that imo all their good for is wackin em with a hockey stick.

These striatus are a bit hard on the eyes,the hispidus is a much better option,its colour is far better.
Hey whats your take on my probs,what do you think i should do,i am thinking of taking them out and treating,there goes my live rock design

Well i don't know what odinium is (i'm fairly sure thats how its spelled, but not 100%) but with the white spot whenever i get a fish with white spot, i mean mine are all local caught so i expect them to be a bit tougher.. but i soak nori / algae sheets (don't buy from an LFS, mine charges 3x if not more than you can buy for at coles) in garlic and feed them that.

After a week or so, the water in the little container i use for soaking i defrost the frozen food in a cup, and i'll scoop the water from the container instead of tank water (it is originally tank water) and i might put a peice of garlic from the container into the little cup.. and feed them that.

my son saw that and said,mum can we have one?he is in bed now and there is no way one of those will be in our tank.
The thing is it is hard not to look at it,so gross yet its almost hypnotic,thats so random.
Just came to have a look at the trips your club has and deffinitly not dissapointed,love the marine inhabitants.

Mate for white spot, which is a form of protozoan, you could try lowering specific gravity (salt content), and extensive exposure to 0.10-0.15 ppm levels of copper sulphate, cupromine is a treatment based on that,aquasonic put that one out if I remember right.

Or just make your own, get some copper sulphate powder, the chemist used to sell it over the counter, mix it with some warm filtered tap water and ad a little citric acid from woollies and start dosing until it hits the right levels and keep monitoring it.

Do not have any porus material in the quarantine tank with it, just some sections of plastic pipe for the fish to hide in.

The Oodinium thing, well these are a pretty aggressive little blood sucker,so to speak, the name oodinium was applied to the Amyloodinium Ocellatum which is a Flagellate Protozoan.

This little beggar colonises the gills and body surface area of the host fish; than appears as a (velvet) covering, is that what is happening?

If your fish have this it is serious, it goes from scratching, heavy breathing, there gills get damaged and slowly, but normally, they die.

One of our clubbies lost some quite expensive and beautiful fish to the same parrasite just recently.

This is a very serious parasite that originally did not come from your tank.

If you don’t quarantine you’re bought fish as if they have a major parasite than the quarantining you did initially was a waste of time!!

Just to be sure..

Don't put copper into your main tank, unless you never want to have corals and inverts in that tank, ever again. I've heard it actually gets into the silicon in the tank so if you use a quarantine tank, make sure you never want to use it for a display.

I just got home and i am taking them out now and they are going into the quaratine set up for a while with copper treatment i got off my mate and garlic infused foods i will be making up,thanks again

Why should i use bits of plastic pipes in my quarantine tank,whats that for?
I have some old (dead) live rock i was going to use,is that okay?
Any more tricks of the trade on what i should do.

Dead rock will end up trying to cycle, which means amm nitrite and nitrate.

Plastic pipe won't.

When you use porus matreial like coral,it has more surface area for the copper to attach to and the bits of plastic have very little suface area and are very easy to rinse the copper sulphate off under the tap.
The copper will attach to everything if it can,glass silicon,pumps,etc,including the fishes body,hence the severe muccus depletion when using copper sulphate and the problems from this when introducing a fish with this result into a tank with no muccuss protection.
That why the shops try not use it ongoing,you buy a fish with no protection,for a short while.
The fish have to have a place to hide or the adrenalin as a result of that stress will most likely kill it even if the oodinium doesn't.
Monitor those copper levels,the stuff fluctuats in its intensity with changing temps as well.

The reason it works so well on parrasites and bacteria is in just tolerable doses to fish it kills all primitive creatures via their breathing apparatise,all inverts(white spot,oodinium,etc)suffercate to death.

So would you suggest a copper treatment, then place them into another tank on their own where they won't stress out so they can get their slime coating back.. and then put then into the main tank? Or just straight from copper to main?

Once the treatment has been at its most for at least a week ,(ten days are good)after slowly raising the levels to begin with,than slowly reduce it by water changes over two dyas and place the fish in a plastic bag and aclimatise as per normal,don't worry about the copper in the bag going into the display tank,it would add up to virtualy nothing.
Than keep your quarantine always at the minumum copper leverls ready for the next time.
White spot has life span of roughly 48 hours and oodinium is around ten days!

The slime coat is one of the fish's main defenses against infection and disease………………………….

Read the entire article at http://www.arkansasstripers.com/fish-slime-coat.htm
:

Mate i would recommend vertonex. It is a bit dear but it does not have copper in it so it is reef safe and doesn´t affect invertebrates. You can use it in your display tank for 4 days and then leave for a couple of weeks. After that a large water change will be in order.

I would also give the fish a fresh water bath for some 3-4 mins with lots of aeration, then put them in a QT with vertonex. It has worked for me very well, Also keep soaking fish food in garlic, that will help boost the fish´s immune system.

Failing all of the above, try the hypo salinity treatment described above, together with a rise in the water temperature. If all that fails ( and the fish is still alive) then copramine, as the last resort. I would try to avoid it though....

With every new fish you purchase, I would do something similar., use vertonex in QT just to rid it from any parasites while in quarantine.

Also I would recommend you feed your fish in the display tank the garlic soaked food at least once a week.

Personally I prefer copper treatments as it can be used on quite an extensive range of marine parasites. I know it is only really for salt water as it can be hard to control the levels of toxicity in freshwater when lower Ph causes the precipitated copper to re dissolve, so to speak, but I am a marine keeper so who cares.

When Ph is constant and that is so easy and organic matter in the quarantine tank is at a minimum the copper is less likely to bind up in it and the copper sulphate can do its bit with your complete confidence.

The main component of the other is malachite green, used to be called malachite blue in the eighties, it’s an actual antifungal and for bacterial problems in freshwater systems and if I remember right at certain levels used to turn your silicon blue.

With the use of copper sulphate,the solution is prepared using 1 gram of copper sulphate (CuSO4.5H2O) to 250 mls in RO or just highly filtered water. This solution should contain 1 mg copper per millilitre. The initial dose is 0.15 mg copper per litre.Say if your system contains say 200 litres then the dosing required will be 200 x 0.15 mgs copper = 30 grams = 30 mls of solution.

The copper levels in the aquarium should be measured straight away and there on a couple of times a day using a test-kit that measures in increments of at least 0.05 mg/litre. If the residual copper level in the tank drops below 0.15 mg/litre - then add additional doses of 0/05 mg/ litre of the solution until the optimum level is restored. Using the same example 200 x 0.05 mgs copper = 10 mgs copper = 10 mls stock solution.
I have used levels as high as 0.25 but it should be kept at 0.15 to 0.20,at 0.25 i had minimal probs,mainly only with small gill plated fish.

Don’t forget as with most substances, copper can easily be removed by activated carbon or reduce it with some water changes.

My mate checked what you all said about the vertonex on some other forums and they seem to agree it was the way to do it,it didn't work for me
After i lost the first ocy and the others were getting really bad i got them all out and tried the freshwater bath out of desperation.
I will have to start again,i had only five fish and i really liked the black ocy and the bispinosus.
Back to the drawing board,thanks anyway guys.
I looked up some of these treatments on the net and some say that the copper is the simplest treatment to use,the forums all disagree,i think i will look into that a little more for next time.
Hey just a quick question!
The fish you catch,do you get any bispinosus around your neck of the woods.
I have been to bris lots of times from here in Gympie and you hardly ever see them in the shops there
Do they just come from the barrier reef?
i have only seen two of your trips and it looks like so much fun,are there any more than the two trips i have seen?

Am i stupid you guys changed the pic up the top,that is such a pretty fish,are they around bris?

Hey mate,

Sucks to hear about your fish.. But we've all been there, i know i have..

Yes there has been one or two Coral Beauty's caught while i've been in the club (since april), and a few other angel species are found locally.

Theres heaps of trips on here, their all in the snorkelling collecting ect area down the bottom of the main page of the forum.

The sweetlips is a local fish, i've seen two or three while snorkelling myself, two yellowish and one of the orange. I think the orange is a slightly different species, but their apparently quite hard to catch.

What size tank do you have? Can you put up some pictures of the tank, sump (if you have one) and your filtration, i'd like to see your setup. Perhaps you've gone wrong somewhere in your filtration and we can help you further if we see some photos.

Also what is your tanks parameters? Sg, Amm, Nitrite, Nitrate, Temp ect.

The tank is 3ft by 18inches by 15inches lighting high out put power compacts resun chiller,30 mil substrate,aquamedic skimmer,carbon filter,refug,a lot of live rock,small sand bed.
Temp 25 cel-cal 465ppm-nitrate 010-0 amonia-0 nitrite-day time ph 8.3,night time ph 8.1-alc 3.0 to 3.5 meq/L-salinity 25 on my specific gravity tester.
I had to move the live rock to get the fish out and it looks sad now.
when it looks good again i will post some photos.
The parrameters are all good,the probs started not long after i put in a tang,a powder blue.
My mates a science assist he has the bodies and is going to do some tests to just see what they had,i know it was velvet and some other protos,next time i will do better.
I don't know if it was the vertonex,but two of my sps i have had a while and they were good in another tank as well before,they bleached really fast,2 days after treating and algae is covering them now
I don't have phosphate probs either and no hair algae,tiny amount of cyno in one corner and i haven't seen an apitasia yet.
Doesn't matter,it will be all good soon.

All seems fine going by that, although from what i've gathered alkalinity should be up around 8 - 10. I haven't had a chance to test my own tanks alkalinity, so i wouldn't know what mine is at. Other than that the params seem good.

Velvet seems to be one of the diseases you can't cure, and mainly with clownfish.

Edit: Just reread, and noticed something on another forum. Your alk is in the right area. I don't know much about alk just yet, although didn't realise there was two methods of measuring (meq/L and dKH). Supposed to be kept around the 2.5 - 3.5 meg/L or 8 - 10 dKH.

Even in massive infestations copper sulphate nocks it off no worries,if done right.
To understand the coralation between slime coating,stress and treatments it takes a while and some dead fish.
velvet can not be treated in an aquarium affectivly!!

Sorry to hear about you lost your fish....

I reckon the coral issue may have not been related to the vertonex, as I have used it in my display where I keep acros, montis and pocilloporas with no issue at all. As far as I new only clams and mussels would be affected by vertonex. But all tanks are different......

All I could say is that if you have no more fish in your tank just leave it like that for some 14 days so all ich parasites just die.

then definitely Quarantine your fish before you put them in your tank. I usually give any new fish a 3 min fresh water bath and a quick light vertonex treatment for a week in a separate tank.

I reckon not all fish handle the copper well, specially angels are really bad with it. I have lost 2 using copper, my favourite eblii angel and a bi color angel

I do agree with admin, you may loose some fish no matter what you do.

Another thing that may help you is to run a UV filter through your sump or somewhere. That will kill the parasites...but also some other good bacteria.....

Cheers

Hey guys

Just heard about this product, it is called medic, it is reef safe, not copper based and effective in the treatment of white spot and marine velvet.

I do not think is quite new, but may be fairly new in australia. It is made by a canadian lab.

Here is a link for you

http://polyplab.com/medic.html

Seems quite interesting and now people that have had success with it.